Will if ever?

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NLS
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Will if ever?

Post by NLS » Mon Dec 31, 2007 10:56 am

I am sure someone will point me to some link or FAQ or a "use search"-cliche or something, but I wonder if any of the following engines is even in remote consideration for SCUMMVM's future: Magnetic Scrolls (best candidate as seems there is no real engine development for years), ICOM (pleeeease, it is point-n-click), Level 9 (A-code), Scott Adams.

Most of which are not point and click, but still Classics and still Adventures.

Maybe a side project for "non-point-and-click" (also to include Z-machine in its blanket but not support ONLY Z-machine?).

See this also:

http://pdd.if-legends.org/

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eriktorbjorn
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Re: Will if ever?

Post by eriktorbjorn » Mon Dec 31, 2007 11:21 am

For text adventures - even illustrated ones - I'd much rather use an interpreter that's good at handling text. ScummVM does not currently include any advanced font rendering, clipboard support, etc.

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dreammaster
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Re: Will if ever?

Post by dreammaster » Mon Dec 31, 2007 11:27 am

NLS wrote:Magnetic Scrolls (best candidate as seems there is no real engine development for years)
One of the most important things to remember is that just adding a game engine to ScummVM won't magically make people appear to work on it - if it hasn't been worked on for years, there's no reason to believe that adding it to ScummVM will cause that to change. Not only that, but to convert an existing engine to work with ScummVM in the first place requires a substantial effort as well.

So if you'd really like to see a particular game engine added, it, the best thing to do is to do it yourself - study the existing implementation's source code, study some of ScummVM's existing game engines, and try and port the engine over to run under ScummVM. Don't let a lack of familiarity with programming daunt you - this could be the ideal project for you to learn :wink:

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Post by Tramboi » Mon Dec 31, 2007 11:54 am

Yep Gargoyle is what you need for text adventu...
/pedantic:on
interactive fiction, sorry :twisted:

ScummVM backend is not at all geared towards rendering text.

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df
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Post by df » Mon Dec 31, 2007 4:38 pm

There is no work on the magnetic scrolls front because "magnetic" is done. it plays all the games including magnetic windows etc.

ICOM stuff would be interesting but with only 4 games its kinda limited, and I didnt think any of those are stellar games.

Having written a scott adams emulator I dont see the point in trying to add it or zcode or acode to scummvm.

Like magnetic, the l9 interpreter is "done" and doesnt need updating since it plays all the games.

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Kaminari
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Re: Will if ever?

Post by Kaminari » Wed Jan 02, 2008 3:49 am

NLS wrote:I wonder if any of the following engines
Gargoyle
Gargoyle-mod

NLS
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Post by NLS » Wed Jan 02, 2008 8:33 am

Thanks Kaminari!

What is that "mod" version? I cannot read Italian (will use on-line translator but sometimes those things are not clear).

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Post by Kaminari » Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:41 pm

It's an unofficial update with some interpreters fixed (glulxe mainly). It also supports Unicode.

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Post by NLS » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:46 am

ah thanks again

its default settings are ugly though (I mean the "non-mod" looks better than the mod)

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Post by NLS » Sat Oct 16, 2010 9:14 pm

I wake up this thread of mine from almost three years ago (!!!), to ask/comment...

1) Gargoyle has moved to googlecode and has a build 1.2010 (newer than SCUMMVM-MISC one). Any plans to update yours?
http://code.google.com/p/garglk/

2) Why is it so bad to include Gargoyle to the main build? It's not that a big engine. Yes it's not really point and click (although you could allow for clickable compass and maybe some basic clickable commands), but ok SCUMMVM is already was "loose" from its original definition.

3) What about Magnetic Scrolls? (there is an independent project called Magnetic plus I think it is included in Gargoyle) Scott Adams?

4) ICOM? It is the definition of point and click (and double-click, and click-n-drag, you name it :D)...

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dreammaster
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Post by dreammaster » Sat Oct 16, 2010 9:52 pm

NLS wrote:I wake up this thread of mine from almost three years ago (!!!), to ask/comment...

1) Gargoyle has moved to googlecode and has a build 1.2010 (newer than SCUMMVM-MISC one). Any plans to update yours?
http://code.google.com/p/garglk/
Not really. Although I called the engine Gargoyle, I have only ever gotten as far as converting the Frotz engine core to run under ScummVM. Plus, mine doesn't implement the Glk layer that Gargoyle does - it simply reimplements the I/O core under Frotz, so it isn't really related to the other Gargoyle project.
NLS wrote: 2) Why is it so bad to include Gargoyle to the main build? It's not that a big engine. Yes it's not really point and click (although you could allow for clickable compass and maybe some basic clickable commands), but ok SCUMMVM is already was "loose" from its original definition.
Whilst I personally think along those lines, the group discussion was that ScummVM is desired to be kept more for point-n-click adventures. Other types get included only if they share a codebase with some existing point-n-click game engine, such as for the Simon Puzzle Pack, or Lands of Lore.
NLS wrote: 3) What about Magnetic Scrolls? (there is an independent project called Magnetic plus I think it is included in Gargoyle) Scott Adams?

- we already have the AGI engine, which has text input, but with moving characters, and the Mohawk engine
From what I've seen, they're like the early Legend games (screen pictures with text input). I don't think there's ever been a discussion of whether such games would be appropriate or not. Then again, no one has actually stood up and volenteered to work on the games, so it's a moot point at the moment.
NLS wrote: 4) ICOM? It is the definition of point and click (and double-click, and click-n-drag, you name it :D)...
Some of them definitely fit in. So it's just a matter of finding someone willing to devote the months and/or years of time to working on any of them, either reverse engineering the games from scratch, or hunting down original source code for the games.

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Post by Red_Breast » Sat Oct 16, 2010 11:00 pm

I compiled a ScummVM build with Gargoyle once and tried some IF with it. Overall I have to agree with what Dr McCoy said in another thread.
viewtopic.php?t=6183&start=195

Dr McCoy quote -
"Yeah, there already was a discussion about that. And the final decision was that it doesn't belong into ScummVM.
Even I -- and I'm quite an "inclusionist" -- didn't really think it fits. When playing text adventures, I like to have the features (and feel) of a terminal: copy & pasting, input sequences like ^W for delete word, etc.. ScummVM doesn't provide that, isn't laid-out for that."

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