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Loom CD talkie problem
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Who'sThere



Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Posts: 46
Loom CD talkie problem 

Hi,
I'm having a problem the Loom DOS talkie version. I ripped the track from the disc as a WAV file, and then I encoded it with Audacity to a VBR, 256kbps, 44100Hz, Stereo, Mp3 file.

When I try running it on the Dreamcast, I'll select the Difficulty, there'll be a 2-3 minute wait to see the title screen.

Then... if I want to check an item etc. I have to wait minutes to hear the item-sound. Basically it takes forever to load the sound data.

I tested it on the PC with the latest ScummVM, and I don't have these loading times.

Can anybody check to see if they have same problem?

Sorry, I didn't ask this in the DC sub-forum because I thought it get over-looked. Not too much action there...

Anyways, any help would be appreciated.

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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:05 pm 
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MusicallyInspired



Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 949
Location: Manitoba, Canada
 

Should be posted in the Dreamcast section. I'm guessing it's because of the Dreamcast port takes a while to load MP3s form a disc.

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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:53 pm 
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eriktorbjorn
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Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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There have been reports that Ogg Vorbis or FLAC are quicker to handle on some platforms. I'm not sure whether or not that applies to the Dreamcast port, though.

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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:34 pm 
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Who'sThere



Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Posts: 46
 

quote:
Originally posted by MusicallyInspired
Should be posted in the Dreamcast section. I'm guessing it's because of the Dreamcast port takes a while to load MP3s form a disc.
Could a inspired mod/admin move it for me..? Please.

quote:
Originally posted by eriktorbjorn
There have been reports that Ogg Vorbis or FLAC are quicker to handle on some platforms. I'm not sure whether or not that applies to the Dreamcast port, though.
OGG & FLAC support was never added to the DC port.
If I might ask a couple questions though...

Wouldn't uncompressed WAV, or FLAC be faster, as they wouldn't require decompression processing time? - (Space & RAM limits aside.)

And, what would the optimal settings be, for mp3 compression of cdda audio?

Should I use CBR or VBR?

Should it be below a certain bitrate like 160, 128, 64? At 22,050Hz, 32,000Hz, or 41,000Hz?
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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:51 pm 
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MusicallyInspired



Joined: 02 Mar 2007
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Location: Manitoba, Canada
 

I really don't think the birate matters that much or whether it's CBR or VBR. Uncompressed WAV would probably be a lot faster, though.

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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:04 pm 
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Longcat



Joined: 23 Sep 2006
Posts: 944
 

hmm. wav streams have a lot more data to load than an mp3.

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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:18 pm 
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MusicallyInspired



Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 949
Location: Manitoba, Canada
 

Longer load time than reading a compressed MP3?

I don't know I'm just guessing.

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Post Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:26 pm 
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joostp
ScummVM Developer


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
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VBR makes seeking very hard/complicated. Try CBR at 96 or 128kbps.

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Post Thu Jun 11, 2009 9:05 am 
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Who'sThere



Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Posts: 46
 

quote:
Originally posted by joostp
VBR makes seeking very hard/complicated. Try CBR at 96 or 128kbps.
Thanks for the heads up. Smile
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Post Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:18 pm 
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Harrypoppins



Joined: 25 Apr 2009
Posts: 73
 

Hello.

I've also this version of Loom, and i have found a french patch for the subtiles, in .txt but it's don't work, if someone know how use it. I'm a mac user Wink.

Thanks

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Post Sun Jun 14, 2009 4:23 pm 
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Stryfe



Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Posts: 65
 

There's a thread here on the forums with links to french, german, and spanish(?) patche sites, but all but the german site link are down.

Maybe someone else here would know more...

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Post Thu Jun 18, 2009 3:42 pm 
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Who'sThere



Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Posts: 46
 

I'm just checking back with the results here.

Well I re-encoded the the track at both 128 & 64 kbps. While the lag/load time was reduced, it still was playing at an unpractical speed.

I continued re-encoding until I reached the breaking point of the speech being recognizable, which was about 32 kbps at either 16 or 22.05 kHz...

I think I ended up using the bitrate recommended for some cellphone scummvm port, and it still had significant lag.

I take it then that the Dreamcast just can't handle the audio track? Is there any possibility that the performance could improve on the track seeking, or is it beyond the hardware limitations of the game unit?

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Post Tue Jul 28, 2009 2:10 am 
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eriktorbjorn
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Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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quote:
Originally posted by Who'sThere

I take it then that the Dreamcast just can't handle the audio track? Is there any possibility that the performance could improve on the track seeking, or is it beyond the hardware limitations of the game unit?


Seeking used to be very simple when ScummVM only supported constant bit rate. Now, if I understand correctly, it has to start at the beginning of the file and look at each frame until it finds the correct one. I guess that adds up on slower hardware.

I don't know if there's some simple way to determine if the file uses constant or variable bit rate. If there isn't perhaps it would be possible to add a setting to ScummVM to tell it to assume it's constant bit rate, and use the older faster seeking in that case?
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Post Tue Jul 28, 2009 4:27 am 
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Who'sThere



Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Posts: 46
 

quote:
Originally posted by eriktorbjorn
I don't know if there's some simple way to determine if the file uses constant or variable bit rate. If there isn't perhaps it would be possible to add a setting to ScummVM to tell it to assume it's constant bit rate, and use the older faster seeking in that case?


You wouldn't happen to know which version of ScummVM was the last to use the older method?
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Post Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:26 pm 
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DCDayDreamer



Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 90
Location: Dream Land
 

There's not much you can do about the audio lag with Loom, a version of ScummVM with better seeking times might improve it slightly but the lag would still be there on the Dreamcast. This is mainly due to the audio file being one large track as opposed to a set of small tracks within a resource file.

quote:
Originally posted by Who'sThere
Well I re-encoded the the track at both 128 & 64 kbps. While the lag/load time was reduced, it still was playing at an unpractical speed.

The improvement you encountered was most likely due to the reduction in file size and not the bitrate, if you read what eriktorbjorn posted above: "it has to start at the beginning of the file and look at each frame until it finds the correct one", the reduction in file size meant the Dreamcast could read the data quicker from the CD, and hence find the required frame a little quicker.

The best performance you are likely to get with Loom on the Dreamcast is to create a CD with only that game, reduce the audio track bitrate to an acceptable level, and dummy the CD to the maximum capacity of your CDR. If it's any consolation, even the SD card adapter won't improve the game to any great extent (at present).
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Post Tue Jul 28, 2009 9:31 pm 
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