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Another game
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db92



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
Another game 

there was another game in a style of monkey island.. the night of the hermit... is it possible that it could be supported?

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Post Mon Jan 02, 2006 11:48 am 
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Adventureguy



Joined: 25 Dec 2005
Posts: 163
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany
 

I don't think so. This game was not produced by Lucas Arts since it's a fan adventure. Besides, this game was produced with AGS ( http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk ). I don't know if it would be possibly to operate with the sourcecode, but i think this game is also playable with at least Windows and not only on DOS. If it would be possible to support AGS-Games to ScummVM, then Maniac Mansion Deluxe wouldn't be a problem for support either. But then, I don't know for sure why MMD isn't supported since the link in the FAQ is outdated (well, i can't find MMD mentioned there) and Lucasfangames' Website seems to be dead ( http://www.lucasfangames.de/ ).
Anyway, if it's possible to enter the source code for an AGS-game, then ask the programmer Roy Lazarovich for the source and get a group of programmers willing to implement it in the ScummVM project.

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Post Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:27 pm 
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db92



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
 

so if i can find someone interested, u r willing to implement it?

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Post Mon Jan 02, 2006 5:38 pm 
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db92



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
 

i sent a mail to roy lazarovich.. he told me he doesnt have the code anymore, however if someone is able to extract it, we have permission to make it work on scummvm.. Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Wink Very Happy Very Happy

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Post Mon Jan 02, 2006 5:57 pm 
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Adventureguy



Joined: 25 Dec 2005
Posts: 163
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany
 

Good luck in finding someone who can extract it. I don't know if it's possible to extract files from an AGS-game, but maybe someone created a tool to do so. Maybe you can ask Chris Jones if it's possible to extract files from a compiled version. But without the source, it'll get a lot more complicated to implement. If you're lucky and can extract the source itself from the compiled file, then it's much easier. Or ask Roy again if he knows someone (beta-testers,etc.), who may still have the uncompiled version(s). Maybe it's even possible to implement it without the source? Having the permission is a good sign, but it's worthless if we don't know how to implement it. But don't loose hope, it's not said it can't be done. Maybe someone else in the forum knows a solution for this problem, since I got no more ideas on this topic yet Neutral .

As Joe King would say:
"Oil be back!" Laughing Wink

edit: Here I am again. I looked in an german adventure forum, where some guy also wanted to decompile a compiled version of his AGS game. He got the advise to ask Chris Jones if he could decompile his version. Don't think Chris Jones did it, but if Roy would say it to him with provided support of the ScummVM team, it might work. It's just an idea, since I think you REALLY need the source, so CJ would be the next address to ask because only he knows the sourcecode of the AGS program afaik.

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Post Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:27 pm 
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sev
ScummVM Lead


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1949
 

What's the point of obtaining game source when the thing which is needed is engine source. AGS in this case. Though AGS author doesn't want to share his code because he doesn't want decompilers to be implemented. At least he states that in his FAQ.


Eugene

PS. Maniac Mansion Deluxe in considered warez these days because of legal issues between LucasArts and LucasFans guys.

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Post Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:15 pm 
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Adventureguy



Joined: 25 Dec 2005
Posts: 163
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany
 

quote:
Originally posted by sev
PS. Maniac Mansion Deluxe in considered warez these days because of legal issues between LucasArts and LucasFans guys.


That's the first time I hear MMD is considered as warez Shocked . What's exactly going on between LucasArts and LucasFan? How comes you know something of that, since browsing through the net, I only read rumors why you hear nothing anymore about LucasFan's Indy 1 project and why he shut down his website. Do you have any evidence MMD is warez because I don't believe this. It's just a freeware fanadventure! Lots of sites are still having MMD for Download, so I think LucasArts would have contacted them to put MMD from their servers, and most of the sites are pretty serious, like the Adventure-Treff.
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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:16 am 
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sev
ScummVM Lead


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1949
 

quote:
Originally posted by Adventureguy
That's the first time I hear MMD is considered as warez Shocked .

heh, did you see this?

quote:
Originally posted by http://www.lucasfangames.de/

Recent events have forced us to shut down our web appearance. We would like to thank all our fans and supporters who believed in us and our dreams.


What else evidence you need? They used losts of copyrighted material without permission: story, characters, game title, music.


Eugene
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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 10:33 am 
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db92



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
 

chris jones, notes that with his program ppl can make games that can be even charged to take.. that means that if i got roy's code we could manage to put it? or there's something else missing as well?

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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 11:02 am 
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sev
ScummVM Lead


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1949
 

Also I recommend to read a bit here:

http://www.yaz0r.net/index.php?title=fan_made_game_shutdown_again&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

Take a note about their usual practice. Yaz0r knows the stuff. Wink


Eugene

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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 11:02 am 
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db92



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
 

i saw the site, but what's ur exact point?

edit: btw, can mi4 b supported?

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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 11:07 am 
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eriktorbjorn
ScummVM Developer


Joined: 31 Oct 2005
Posts: 3298
 

quote:
Originally posted by db92
chris jones, notes that with his program ppl can make games that can be even charged to take.. that means that if i got roy's code we could manage to put it? or there's something else missing as well?


If I've understand the discussion correctly, all we could get from Roy is the description of how the game works within the context of Chris's game engine. And that's not necessarily very helpful. Consider the following examples...

code:

fix torch time ifprop sundial 0 386
fix torch time ifprop null 0 387
fix torch time destroydec sundial 388 0




code:

{ drop gnomon sundial }:
holdinga(second, object) 'o' ->>
        !? ("There's no room for " +
                the%(first) + ", " + the%(second) +
                    " is holding " + a%(o) +
                    ", birdbrain.*N"),
aflame(first) ->>
        !? (theu%(first) +
                " is aflame! Put it out, you jerk,*
                * you'll burn yourself!*N"),
        $(      checknkeeping(first)
                drop%(first, second)
                !! (theu%(first) +
                        " seems to be just the*
                        * right length for you to*
                        * be able to tell the time*
                        * from " +
                        the%(second) + ".*N")
        $)




code:

<OBJECT ["SWORD" "ORCRI" "GLAMD" "BLADE"]
        ["ELVIS"]
        "sword"
        <+ ,OVISON ,TAKEBIT ,WEAPONBIT>
        SWORD
        ()
        (ODESCO
"On hooks above the mantelpiece hangs an elvish sword of great
antiquity."
         ODESC1 "There is an elvish sword here."
         OSIZE 30
         OFMSGS ,SWORD-MELEE
         OTVAL 0)>




...all of which are genuine examples of source code from adventure games, albeit text-based rather than graphical. Even if you were able to figure out approximately what they meant, it's not enough if you want to faithfully re-create the games. You need to fully understand the underlying world model, provided by the game engine.
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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 12:41 pm 
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db92



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 49
 

so only if we could get help from chris jones, that we can't, we can somehow get that to work?

edit: i know, im a noob but im convinced there's some way someone can make this game work... i found this prog and i hope this is something that can help... because of my noobiness i havent even tried to launch this prog...

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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 12:55 pm 
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john_doe
ScummVM Developer


Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 117
Location: Stuttgart, Germany
 

The only way this could work is either 1) get the source code and make a new engine based on the AGS formats (the raw/uncompiled source files) or 2) make an interpreter for the already compiled AGS data.
Both is imo unlikely to happen.


Last edited by john_doe on Tue Jan 03, 2006 2:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 2:07 pm 
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eriktorbjorn
ScummVM Developer


Joined: 31 Oct 2005
Posts: 3298
 

quote:
Originally posted by db92
so only if we could get help from chris jones, that we can't, we can somehow get that to work?


That or reverse-engineering, I suppose. Judging by the AGS FAQ there isn't much hope of the former. As for the latter... From what I can tell, AGS is being actively maintained, so why should the ScummVM project strive to emulate it?
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Post Tue Jan 03, 2006 2:08 pm 
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