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PS3 Scummvm?
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savagenick



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 15
 

You can install CFW straight off a USB stick, and you'll need it to run any emulators or homebrew as the PS3 won't run anything without installing it first, and you can't do that without CFW. Having it signed or not doesn't matter if you can't install it in the first place!

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Post Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:03 am 
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SuperDre



Joined: 31 May 2007
Posts: 157
Location: helmond.nl
 

quote:
Originally posted by savagenick
You can install CFW straight off a USB stick, and you'll need it to run any emulators or homebrew as the PS3 won't run anything without installing it first, and you can't do that without CFW. Having it signed or not doesn't matter if you can't install it in the first place!


I wonder why it can't run anything without installing first, as a regular bluray game can be run without installing.
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Post Sun Jan 09, 2011 5:09 am 
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Red_Breast



Joined: 30 Sep 2008
Posts: 785
Location: The Bar Of Gold, Upper Swandam Lane.
 

I usually watch the Chaos Computer Club (CCC) presentations live every Xmas however this year I couldn't. I've just watched the fail0verflow video. I'm always amazed how the console makers go to great lengths in some areas to protect their consoles but choose bad decisions in other areas.
I often hear and read that the PS3 is the most secure console but now it seems that the 360 with it's eFUSE technology that prevents downgrading is more secure.
Forgive me if I've misunderstood something in the video. I have trouble understanding some of it but I always find the videos great to watch. You can download the presentation as an .mp4 from the CCC site and like the Team Twiizers presentations they bring some humour to the proceedings.

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Post Sun Jan 09, 2011 3:06 pm 
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savagenick



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 15
 

Simply, it can't run anything before installing it first because in order to execute something from the blu ray drive the system needs to "mount" the disk first (i.e. link it in RAM to the processor). This requires the use of "syscalls" which are not available in the CFW (exactly because it allows piracy). No doubt some1 will eventually release CFW which includes these and then yes, you won't need to install it.

@Red_Breast:
The PS3 is still the most secure console - the fact that some1 has finally found a way of cracking it doesn't change that fact. Baring in mind they have been working constantly since the original PS3 release and have only now managed it whereas the 360 was cracked years ago sorta proves that. The "eFuse" thing is just standard MS marketing BS anyway.

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Post Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:02 am 
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Angelus3K



Joined: 19 Nov 2005
Posts: 73
 

quote:
Originally posted by savagenick
@Red_Breast:
The PS3 is still the most secure console - the fact that some1 has finally found a way of cracking it doesn't change that fact. Baring in mind they have been working constantly since the original PS3 release and have only now managed it whereas the 360 was cracked years ago sorta proves that. The "eFuse" thing is just standard MS marketing BS anyway.


They did say in the fail0verflow conference that it only took them a few months to find the keys. They haven't been working on it since PS3 release, they only started on it after Sony removed OtherOS from phat and lied about it not working on the Slim.
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Post Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:09 am 
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SuperDre



Joined: 31 May 2007
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Location: helmond.nl
 

quote:
Originally posted by Angelus3K
They did say in the fail0verflow conference that it only took them a few months to find the keys. They haven't been working on it since PS3 release, they only started on it after Sony removed OtherOS from phat and lied about it not working on the Slim.


People have been working on it since the PS3 was released, the failoverflow team made use (just like it also made use of Geohot's initial hack) of the knowledge that came from that 'research', just like Geohot's initial hack also relied on previous work..
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Post Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:35 pm 
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fingolfin
Retired


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1466
 

Based on the nature of their findings and how they did it, though, it seems very plausible that this could have been done some years ago already, if people with the right background had attempted to. But it wasn't that attractive for them. Anyway, this is all speculation.

The correlation between how safe & secure a system is, and how long it takes to break it, is very weak. Many other factors apply, financial interest not being the least. Console manufactures are good add security by obscurity, but if one looks at *how* consoles have been broken so far, this always relies on very dumb and stupid fundamental mistakes some people made who obviously were not really security pros... And I am pretty sure this won't change in the next console generation either. So they'll still be breakable.. If it takes longer, than simply due to more layers of obscurity hiding the crappy security model at the core Wink.

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Post Mon Jan 10, 2011 8:35 pm 
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SuperDre



Joined: 31 May 2007
Posts: 157
Location: helmond.nl
 

Now, geohot has releases his easy CFW AND signing tools.. So 'all' the wait now is for Scummvm PS3 port running completely on PS3 Light SDK.
I'm now even backuping up my PS3 just to update to 3.55 (and thereby leaving OtherOS for what it was, even though I'm still a bit hesitant).

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Post Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:31 pm 
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savagenick



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 15
 

Some very good points here. Imho I think it's a combination of the "correct" people working on it (now) and the fact that others have spent so long researching. At the end of the day people aren't going to bother repeating the work of others and so baring that in mind the new people are going to start with a decent amount of knowledge and thus a better plan of attack.

Edit: New CFW just been released with the syscalls inserted, all we need now is a scummvm pkg to sign Wink

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Post Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:30 am 
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Red_Breast



Joined: 30 Sep 2008
Posts: 785
Location: The Bar Of Gold, Upper Swandam Lane.
 

I see Sony have started fighting back now.

http://www.next-gen.biz/news/sony-fights-back-with-ps3-hacking-lawsuit

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Post Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:35 pm 
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Angelus3K



Joined: 19 Nov 2005
Posts: 73
 

From what I understand Geohot and fail0verflow have done nothing illegal.

They have not distributed any copyrighted code and the tools they have created have not been made with copyrighted Sony SDK.

Furthermore I read the court document submitted by Sony lawyers and they don't seem to know what they are talking about. They claim that Geohot's jailbroken 3.55 firmware allows ps3 game backups to be ran but it doesnt, it only allows signed homebrew.

Should be very interesting to see how it plays out but I think its just scare tactics at this point.

The keys are out there, damage is done, nothing they can do to change that.

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Post Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:03 pm 
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SuperDre



Joined: 31 May 2007
Posts: 157
Location: helmond.nl
 

quote:
Originally posted by Angelus3K
Furthermore I read the court document submitted by Sony lawyers and they don't seem to know what they are talking about. They claim that Geohot's jailbroken 3.55 firmware allows ps3 game backups to be ran but it doesnt, it only allows signed homebrew.


Well, you'll need geohot's 3.55 firmware because of the 'install packages' option, and with that and already some signed eboots out, it is possible to play game-backups.

BUT they did release tools for signing apps, and the signing apps part might be one of the culprits..
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Post Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:22 pm 
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Angelus3K



Joined: 19 Nov 2005
Posts: 73
 

quote:
Originally posted by SuperDre
quote:
Originally posted by Angelus3K
Furthermore I read the court document submitted by Sony lawyers and they don't seem to know what they are talking about. They claim that Geohot's jailbroken 3.55 firmware allows ps3 game backups to be ran but it doesnt, it only allows signed homebrew.


Well, you'll need geohot's 3.55 firmware because of the 'install packages' option, and with that and already some signed eboots out, it is possible to play game-backups.

BUT they did release tools for signing apps, and the signing apps part might be one of the culprits..


As far as I understand it the backup managers have been signed with the key so they can be installed on Geohot 3.55 Jailbroken firmware but Geohot has purposly decided not to hack LV2 Kernal which allows peeke and poke to certain syscalls to allow backups to run. So currently Geohot's firmware doesnt allow backups to be run although backup managers can be installed.
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Post Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:05 pm 
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Bobbin



Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Posts: 63
Location: Germany
 

quote:
Originally posted by fingolfin
And I am pretty sure this won't change in the next console generation either. So they'll still be breakable.. If it takes longer, than simply due to more layers of obscurity hiding the crappy security model at the core Wink.


Well, it will definitely change as future consoles (maybe not the PS4, but the generation after that) won't rely on physical media anymore but on streaming. Sad as it is (monopolies, no used games market and such) there will always be open platforms so in the end I'm fine with it, I hate piracy.
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Post Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:05 pm 
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Stryfe



Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Posts: 65
 


quote:
Well, it will definitely change as future consoles (maybe not the PS4, but the generation after that) won't rely on physical media anymore but on streaming.


If the next gen systems take a cloud computing approach, which I doubt, the PS3 has more than held it's own. Being out for 4 years now, these hackers have not accomplished what has been done on other systems overnight, allowing piracy.

By the time there's a mainstream availability for PS3 users to abuse their newly found exploits, the system will be, or near to, the end of it's life cycle.


quote:
Sad as it is (monopolies, no used games market and such) there will always be open platforms so in the end I'm fine with it, I hate piracy.

Not to mention the joys of playing online with cheaters... Confused Bleh...
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Post Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:10 am 
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